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Re: Easier than catching law breaking motorists

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 6:43pm
Flinders wrote:Whether the police(whatever) officerwas adequately trained or not, this is clearly the actions of someone whose judgement is so poor they're in the wrong job, or, if voluntary, in the wrong volunteering area.
However, I'm not sure what sort of job/volunteer sector this sort of poor judgement and unnecessarily stroppy conduct would fit anyone for.............

First, as somebody else has suggested, there may be more to this than we know.

Dealing with children/ young people is one of the minefields of everyday policing. Some people want action taking against every child but their own and for various reasons, police are called to deal with children much more than was once the case. The contrasting demands are typified in the frequently reported remarks from people longing for a return of the days when the local bobby dealt with miscreants by administering a clip around the lughole.

A couple of memory lane examples about specials and children.

Now almost 50 years ago, when my hair was still brown, I was delegated to take out a special on patrol. He was recently recruited - ie with less policing experience than I'd gained that week - but had just left the Regular Army after a long career, retiring as a warrant officer. He'd a row of medal ribbons, knew how to be smart in uniform, looked the part and obviously had much more experience of life than I had. We attended a call where the parents of a juvenile had found that he had information relevant to a police appeal. I cannot now remember the details but they were understandably pulled between a civic duty to report the information and a fear of their child becoming involved. I did my best to reassure them and as I was getting the details, my trainee intervened to instruct me to get details of the child's school in case we needed to interview him there. Totally taboo, but it took me some time to get the parents down from the ceiling and it's not easy to convince people that you know much more than somebody old enough to be your dad.

Much more recently, as in about twenty years ago, somebody had the brilliant idea that it would be OK for a couple of specials to patrol together in a car, putting in an appearance at selected minor incidents. As they had radios, they could also turn up at incidents to which they had not been sent. Inevitably, they were eventually first to arrive, indeed the only people to arrive at something a bit outside their depth, in this case a couple of juvenile offenders in their own street. With no real knowledge of what to do next, they decided to bring the suspects back to the reassuring safety of the police station, leaving their parents protesting on the pavement. Luckily, they reported their proposed course of action and were quickly told to take the children home. I was down there PDQ, hair by now largely grey, only one medal ribbon etc., but I was able to sort everything out. Public spirited but untrained people, doing their best.

Re: First two weeks tour in Europe in June: where?

CTC Forum - Touring & Expedition - 10 March 2015 - 6:42pm
For June i would certainly head more northern parts of Europe, Denmark, Norway, Sweden? What about Southern Ireland... a beautiful country....
I have solo toured thru Europe and as a lone female have felt more threatened on my commute to work by a group youths than i ever had lone touring...

Re: Paris to London

CTC Forum - Touring & Expedition - 10 March 2015 - 6:35pm
Dear Caitlin

I agree with others that it's unwise to use a route from Google Maps for this purpose as you'll end up on busy roads and my route via Dieppe and Newhaven is only lightly trafficked and shorter than via Calais.

http://www.donaldhirsch.com/dieppeparis.html

Even though my main descriptions are London, Paris, there is a Paris-London set of instructions here

http://www.donaldhirsch.com/reverse.html

and you can use the main pdf printable guide to see maps of the route which work in either direction.

Good luck, Donald Hirsch

Re: First two weeks tour in Europe in June: where?

CTC Forum - Touring & Expedition - 10 March 2015 - 6:34pm
Denmark or much cheaper with current exchasnge rates, the German Ostseekuste.

Re: lorry passing too close

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 5:54pm
squeaker wrote:Raph wrote:Someone coming up too close from behind is a different issue, there's no evasive action you can take there.
Not strictly true if you are using a rear view mirror and are riding along a road with a soft verge...
or you have left some road space to your left to move into.

Re: Stop!

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 5:51pm
In the interest of balance...

junctions_640.jpg

lookout_640.jpg

Er, but both facing away from the actual traffic.

Rather you than me on this particular road:

centrally_640.jpg

Within a hundred yards or so (East Yorkshire)

Re: Police stop 4yo pavement cyclist

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 5:43pm
As far as I'm aware, even the CTC got it wrong. The four year old was still breaking the law - it's just that they cannot be held responsible.

If it were me with a four year old, I would have let the police officer confiscate the bike and then simply go to my MP and complain. I'd have got the media involved (as they did) with a picture of sad child with cycle helmet stood next to a busy main road - doesn't matter if that wasn't the one that she was meant to ride on.

The law with regards to cycling on a pavement is stupid. In certain circumstances, people should be allowed to ride on the pavement. I think that it is allowed in some European countries - there they have a law against causing a danger on a pavement through use of a bike. When I started commuting to and from work, there were a few stretches of road where I used the pavement - this was along a 50 mph zone going uphill where cars oftem whizz past at probably nearer 80. It's outside the built up part of Sheffield, no one ever uses the pavement (maybe a jogger here and there) - I felt that I was safer on the pavement than on the road. Even tonight riding home, at one point there was a vehicle heading towards me on the wrong side of the road.

Re: Police stop 4yo pavement cyclist

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 5:38pm
In Germany this is covered by law: children up to 8 years old must cycle on the pavement, from 9 - 10 they may cycle on the pavement.

The policeman threatened to confiscate the bike. This reminds me of a punishment applied by the Australian Police to those cycling without a helmt: the cops let their tyres down!

Not sure if I want to laugh or cry.

Re: Police stop 4yo pavement cyclist

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 5:38pm
Maybe the 'pavement cycle' thing is more a way around the standards for cycles, reflectors and so on, rather than it being legal to ride them on the pavement.

http://www.ctc.org.uk/blog/victoria-hazael/children-cycle-pa

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 5:34pm
In Germany this is covered by law: children up to 8 years old must cycle on the pavement, from 9 - 10 they may cycle on the pavement.

The policeman threatened to confiscate the bike. This reminds me of a punishment applied by the Australian Police to those cycling without a helmt: the cops let their tyres down!

Not sure if I want to laugh or cry.

First two weeks tour in Europe in June: where?

CTC Forum - Touring & Expedition - 10 March 2015 - 5:20pm
Hi!
I will have a couple of weeks free in june and I'd like to do a bit of cycling but also have some relaxing holidays - I'm probably aiming at around 3 hours of cycling a day and then spending time on the beach/visiting/walking around.
So it would need to be an interesting area with relatively short distances between spots where I can stop, ideally I could get to the sea (but that is not a priority). It would have to be a rather easy ride as it's my first tour, and relatively safe for a solo female (though we all have different notions of what safe is). I am probably going to camp on campsites, I also like the idea of wild camping though I'm not feeling completely relaxed about it.
So far, I have these ideas:
- Portugal. My first choice, but I've read that it can be unbearably hot in the summer, don't know true it is in June. I don't tolerate heat very well so I guess I should keep it for another time.
- Denmark/Sweden. Don't know too much about it except that it's very beautiful and the weather is nice in the summer.
- Eastern Europe - been hearing about Slovenia and Montenegro for ages and these are definitely places I need to visit soon. Maybe also Albania or Romania? If you had to pick a place, which one would it be?
- Provence, but I am from France and I'd rather do something completely new this time.
Any advice or recommendations I haven't thought of?
Thanks!

Re: Easier than catching law breaking motorists

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 5:09pm
foxyrider wrote:I was under the impression that its not the childs age rather that 'cycles' under 20" wheel (exceptions being adult folding bikes, shoppers etc) are classified as toys, with a different standard which makes them unsuitable for road use. In fact they are actually sold as 'pavement cycles'.

Next they'll be wanting prams and pushchairs off the pavement, scooters, disability chairs........

I've heard this quoted before, but there's not to my knowledge any such law, despite these being occasionally sold as "pavement cycles".

Re: Burly blokes on the pavement - why?

CTC Forum - MTB - 10 March 2015 - 4:33pm
mrjemm wrote:Bicycler wrote:I've heard very occasional comments whilst using towpaths and bridleways from walkers convinced that bicycles weren't allowed. Even then it's been an overheard comment rather than anybody directly challenging me.

I've noticed these are often commented in a rather loud way, kinda passive-aggressive, not wanting to challenge, but wanting you to hear way. In a very similar way to "Ooh, they don't ever have bells any more, do they Deirdre?". Very popular style of comment on the Lune path and canalside between Lanc and Hest Bank... I fitted a bell some time ago purely to counter this effect even though I prefer to use my voice and so now use both, even though I actually think the bell less polite/pleasant.
Yes, I nearly described it as a stage whisper.

I suspect walkers who don't cycle or ride horses pay very little attention to access for these users. Every path is to their mind a footpath.

You can't win with bells. Half the grumps in the population object to cyclists calling out to them, they expect cyclists to have bells and use them, the remainder of the grumps consider use of bells to be a rude "get outta my way" even when rung in good time by a slowing cyclist, they would prefer cyclists to speak to them. I've given up worrying.

Re: NCN-55 Closure (Part of it anyway)

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 3:30pm
It's open again and sooooooooooooo wonderfully smooooooooooooth

So far as far as I can see, Network Rail haven't managed to screw up this section of trail but from what I've read, this won't last. They've already made a pigs a*** of parts of Bolton and Horwich thanks to this stupid tramline.

Re: Police stop 4yo pavement cyclist

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 3:08pm
title of thread changed to be clearer as we have had several threads on this subject, now merged into one.

Re: Easier than catching law breaking motorists

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 2:46pm
Whether the police(whatever) officerwas adequately trained or not, this is clearly the actions of someone whose judgement is so poor they're in the wrong job, or, if voluntary, in the wrong volunteering area.
However, I'm not sure what sort of job/volunteer sector this sort of poor judgement and unnecessarily stroppy conduct would fit anyone for.............

Re: Child 4 On Path...Police We take Bike...

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 2:32pm
I know the child was on the path where she should be at that age, but there are already two threads on this subject...in the 'On The Road' board

Re: Taking a bike on a train

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 2:22pm
If you plan your trip outside of peak times the chances are you will have no traffic problems whatsoever on the Snake Pass, the M60 or any other Manchester area motorway.

Since the disappearance of guards vans on trains in the late 80s taking a bike on a train is a hit and miss affair, and even reservations and other permission can be overridden by the whim of a railway employee.

For a one-off trip just take the car.

Re: Easier than catching law breaking motorists

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 2:21pm
Well, she shouldn't have been riding on the path anyway. Footpaths are for parking on.



(Saw this on the news at lunchtime. At least the police have been round to the house to apologise.)

Child 4 On Path...Police We take Bike...

CTC Forum - On the road - 10 March 2015 - 2:18pm
Hi,

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-li ... e-31805312

"Roger Geffen, of national charity Cyclists' Touring Club, said the officer was "unfair" and "wrong".

"The police officer has forgotten that children under the age of 10 are below the criminal age of responsibility so they can't break laws and can technically ride on the pavement," he said."
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