CTC Forum - On the road

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Updated: 1 hour 58 min ago

Re: Pothole-related fatal crash

8 April 2015 - 6:12pm
The compensation has been agreed, with the highway authority still denying any liability.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-32215664

Re: What is gr8 about motorcycling?

8 April 2015 - 5:23pm
Would we see the same recklessness if all bikes were 250cc or less?
Would not solve the problem. There were 250cc, 100mph bikes on sale to the public in the 1960s The manufacturers would just up the game. Speed sells unfortunately.

Re: Funny what goes through your mind...

8 April 2015 - 4:46pm
Of the couple times I've been hit, in every occurrence I remember picking myself up from the ground, checking the damage to the bike and asking the driver if they were ok. Funnily enough, I've done this calmly each time. Even remarking to one driver who took me out on a roundabout, "Well it could've been worse I suppose" with a smile.
But the near misses, close passes, smidsys and so on leave me wishing I had a mini Gatling gun mounted to the bars to rip said drivers to shreds

Re: What is gr8 about motorcycling?

8 April 2015 - 4:42pm
BigFoz wrote:Like most things (cars / trucks / guns / motorbikes / ladders / stairs / power tools) it's not the article that causes the problem, it's the operation.
True enough I guess but we could use the same logic to allow people to carry knives or handguns.

A motorbike is no more dangerous than a bicycle. It's how they're used that causes problems.
At any given speed the potential to injure is many times greater and the vast majority of the time we're not talking about the same speed.

Should we apply a 70mph limiter to all motor vehicles?
Yes. With an exception for Emergency vehicles and of course vehicles which need to be limited to a lower speed.

I have exceeded the speed limit (pretty sure I have, no speedo...) on my bicycle, do we limit those somehow?
There's no speed limit for bikes. The situations aren't comparable. If cars and motorbikes had a maximum sustainable speed of 20mph and weighed less than 100kg fully laden I wouldn't see a need for urgent regulation.

Why do motorbikes polarise people so badly? They're either cool, or the spawn of satan, and no middle ground. For those who are in the latter camp, think carefully whether you're being rational
I think I'm in the middle. I don't think the road is a place for charging about on and if you are intending to ride perfectly sensibly why would you need a massive engine. That said I see them as a symptom rather than the problem. As you remarked earlier the problem is the human driving/riding. But then does the available power contribute? Would we see the same recklessness if all bikes were 250cc or less?

Re: Funny what goes through your mind...

8 April 2015 - 4:10pm
chris_suffolk wrote:
Had 2 or 3 overtakes in 30mph zone yesterday, when driver passes and brakes for no apparent reason, other than (I suspect) they had to significantly exceed the speed limit to get past, and hadn't judged it correctly in advance. Fun to sail past them at the next queue and let them see how futile it all was.
But it's not as they can practise doing it again. Even more fun for them in a 20mph zone as there are speed humps to brake for as well.

Re: What is gr8 about motorcycling?

8 April 2015 - 4:03pm
Let's get this into perspective. A 200hp motorbike is restricted - i.e. a 17 year should NOT be riding it - it's illegal, there is a qualifying period. Before you can have a more powerful bike. NO SUCH restriction applies to cars. You can take the test at 17 in a Fiat Panda, walk out of the test and get into a 1,200BHP Bugatti and do as you please.

Like most things (cars / trucks / guns / motorbikes / ladders / stairs / power tools) it's not the article that causes the problem, it's the operation. A motorbike is no more dangerous than a bicycle. It's how they're used that causes problems. If you want to ban all fast bikes, then you will also have to go to bat on banning all fast cars. Should we apply a 70mph limiter to all motor vehicles? I have exceeded the speed limit (pretty sure I have, no speedo...) on my bicycle, do we limit those somehow? Why do motorbikes polarise people so badly? They're either cool, or the spawn of satan, and no middle ground. For those who are in the latter camp, think carefully whether you're being rational.

Re: Please ignore!

8 April 2015 - 4:00pm
Tangled Metal wrote:To give you an example of differences that make big changes in the actions of motorists. I live 2 miles from my parents. A nice ride almost all the way up hill with a fast ride back down. It is a popular country road for a stretch which has drivers going really close and at 60mph.

I bought a child trailer and needed to go there with my 9 month old so I did just that worrying myself and my parents. They never got over it but I quickly calmed about it because every driver took a really wide berth. Most waited until they could go completely on the other side even giving us space. I have never been given so much space before. I can only guess they realised a child was in there.


Depriving a parent of a child, absolutely not (and rightly so of course). Depriving a child of its parent? No problem for some motorists!

Re: Please ignore!

8 April 2015 - 3:56pm
Videos played OK on my Mac using Safari.

Cars gave possibly just about enough room, but more would have been much better. However that lorry gave nowhere near enough room for that type of vehicle - just compare the nearside vehicle tracks of the cars compared with the lorry - it was much closer than the cars. No wonder lorries cause the biggest problems, as although many lorry drivers are very good about giving enough space, there are far too many that don't.

Re: Funny what goes through your mind...

8 April 2015 - 3:46pm
Psamathe wrote:I remember a similar incident last summer. Country (but room for cars in both directions) road I was doing 20mph n a 30mph limit and she overtook and started indicating whilst alongside ... but her passenger window was open and boy was she shouting at me. And I just thought how such people say more about themselves that anything else. And she had to brake and then turn left behind me ('cos being downhill and even with mechanical disk brakes I doubt I could have stopped in time for her to turn left).

Ian

Links to another recent thread about how drivers just don't seem to appreciate that a bike can be doing the same speed (or there-abouts) that they are doing.

Had 2 or 3 overtakes in 30mph zone yesterday, when driver passes and brakes for no apparent reason, other than (I suspect) they had to significantly exceed the speed limit to get past, and hadn't judged it correctly in advance. Fun to sail past them at the next queue and let them see how futile it all was.

Re: so when do the shorts come out?

8 April 2015 - 3:41pm
Graduated from longs to 3/4 bibs for the first time in 2015 yesterday (first outing of the year for short sleeves & fingerless mitts too).

Rick.

Re: Funny what goes through your mind...

8 April 2015 - 2:57pm
kwackers wrote:...
Usual attempt at taking me out with a left hook, woman moves out into the right hand lane to overtake and then swings left to try to make the turn whilst not actually having cleared me.
Fortunately much braking by both of us and a collision is averted.

However as the car swings across and I'm admiring the indicator that apparently means I should have given way ...
I remember a similar incident last summer. Country (but room for cars in both directions) road I was doing 20mph n a 30mph limit and she overtook and started indicating whilst alongside ... but her passenger window was open and boy was she shouting at me. And I just thought how such people say more about themselves that anything else. And she had to brake and then turn left behind me ('cos being downhill and even with mechanical disk brakes I doubt I could have stopped in time for her to turn left).

Ian

Re: Please ignore!

8 April 2015 - 2:08pm
IanW wrote:Psamathe wrote:Maybe I should reconsider getting a hi-vis waistcoat with "Video Recording" printed on the back and go for one of those "Baby On Board" stickers/logos instead.

http://bikeyface.com/2011/09/28/perfec-safety-gear/
Excellent. Might work as well. The last bit sums-up so much about cycling on roads
http://bikeyface.com/2011/09/28/perfec-safety-gear/ wrote:Because apparently human beings don’t have a problem with hurting other human beings… just because they happen to have a bicycle.

However intentionally hurting a puppy is a totally different thing. Nobody dares do that. Because that would mean that you’re actually a bad person.

Ian

Re: Funny what goes through your mind...

8 April 2015 - 2:00pm
Or is it?

when I was first knocked off by a car and flying through the air I distinctly remember thinking: "wow that's a nice sun set"...which I wouldn't have seen if the car hadn't have spun me round in the air.

Re: Funny what goes through your mind...

8 April 2015 - 1:27pm
Problem is when people 'know' they are in the right. You shouldn't be cycling in the 'middle of the road', you shouldn't walk across the side road when you can see I'm coming, you shouldn't cycle on the road when there is a cycle path for you, I didn't cut you up... I overtook and you ran into me as I was turning. etc., etc.

Re: Funny what goes through your mind...

8 April 2015 - 1:15pm
bobbyg wrote:Its when they are clearly in the wrong and try and blame you that annoys me.
She was clearly very irate and shouting something about "going around".
Who knows what that was meant to mean.

Re: Please ignore!

8 April 2015 - 12:20pm
pwa wrote:That looks like an awful road. Very busy and not much room. I'm sure you were on it for a good reason, but my first thought with a road like that is always "how can I avoid it?". If I have to ride on that sort of road I ride far enough out to control things (wheel about 75 cm from the kerb is my default position) and try to keep my speed up to get through the bad bit a.s.a.p.

Wheel 75cm from the kerb is exactly where I am on that road - given that the wide angle screws up perceptions, look at the guy behind me, size him up, gauge the front wheel, then mentally lay it on its side from him to the kerb - he's about a wheel diameter from the kerb, sometimes less, in fact I've just noticed he wobbles towards the kerb as the truck passes. On average I'm slightly further out than him.

Speed - c.15mph, on a good day more like 17-18 or 20+ with a tail wind but I don't think safety-wise that makes a lot of difference. If I dawdle for whatever reason I just use the path, which is knobbly and strewn with gravel and crud.

The fact that there are other road users who are half asleep is just a fact of life. In a way I prefer malice from drivers rather than inattentiveness - those that deliberately buzz you are at least intending to miss. Since I moved out of London this kind of thing happens very rarely - this is the worst in nearly 20 years whereas when I lived in the Smoke there were several of these every day, usually accompanied by a tirade of abuse!

Yes there's another route into town, picturesque and lovely, but longer and fast roads with dodgy blind bends, a straight stretch where speeds get up to 70-80mph, at least one significant accident black spot, and I've known of at least two deaths there while I've lived around here, and witnessed one fairly spectacular accident. So more scenic but no better. But the wider point is: do I change my plans in perpetuity every time I go into town, to accommodate the one dozy twerp that can't stay awake at the wheel? Plus I don't know where he's going to appear, I'd have to ring him up on the morning and ask "are you going to drive like an eejit on the main road today or the back route?" and ultimately it's up to him to drive properly and give others a bit of space. In theory the road's for everyone, in practise there's a compromise to be made, if it's only cyclists that compromise by staying off main roads then it's not a compromise and we merely confirm the common misconception that roads are only for cars and cyclists should stay out of the way. The fact that main roads can be unpleasant is another matter.

Re: Funny what goes through your mind...

8 April 2015 - 12:16pm
There are bad drivers of all types of vehicle , bikes included.
All I ask for is someone to acknowledge they have done wrong, a raised hand, a mouthed sorry.

Its when they are clearly in the wrong and try and blame you that annoys me.

My best retaliation , and I have only ever done this once, was reach in the drivers window while he was mouthing off at me, grab the ignition keys, and chucked them into the undergrowth at the side. Obviously followed by a sharp acceleration away by me....

Re: Funny what goes through your mind...

8 April 2015 - 9:58am
I once wondered if those grappling things the police used in one of the speed film franchises to try and stop the "good" guys by frying their ECUs was really invented. I wonder if they could invent a handlebar mounted version. Fire it into the back and fry the electronics of the vehicle.

I do not know where my cycling road rage comes from but I am like you in that I just tend to accept that another bad driver has made a bad decision and move on to idle imaginations of retribution. I'm a very calm person anyway so don't get mad just think of ideas to get even. Never act on them but I find an idea how to safely break their car or van without actually doing it calms me.

Mind you nothing very serious ever happens to me on my bike only a few misdemeanors. Wonder how I would react to pain inflicted by the motorist rather than simple inconvenience (which in my mind gets returned).

Re: Please ignore!

8 April 2015 - 9:53am
pwa wrote:That looks like an awful road. Very busy and not much room. I'm sure you were on it for a good reason, but my first thought with a road like that is always "how can I avoid it?". If I have to ride on that sort of road I ride far enough out to control things (wheel about 75 cm from the kerb is my default position) and try to keep my speed up to get through the bad bit a.s.a.p.
+1

Re: so when do the shorts come out?

8 April 2015 - 9:51am
Those guys knew what they were doing. Mudguards, too, and a cape roll on a minimalist rear carrier.

And that, presumably, was in Italy - although I bet modern Italians are just as susceptible to modern marketing trends as we (well, not all of us!) are in Britain.

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